Deeper look into my suggested CP point calculation

Basis:
A win awards you 3 points and a loss results in a reduction of 2 points, and cw counts has no limit.
[http://atwar-game.com/forum/topic.php?topic_id=13581&message_id=152450#m152450]

And here is New CW ranking with this basis implemented:
1)Mortal Kombat: (58 win-24 loss)----------Total point=126----------Current ranking= 6
2) llyria: ( 60 win-40 loss) ----------Total point=100----------Current ranking=5
3) Stalin Martian: (42 win-31 loss) ----------Total point=64----------Current ranking=7
4) Syndicate: (33 win-30 loss)----------Total point=39----------Current ranking=4
5) Crimson Tide: (20 win-18 loss)----------Total point=24----------Current ranking=2
6) Mystical Society: (10 win-3 loss)----------Total point=24----------Current ranking=3
7) Evol: (34 win-43 loss)----------Total point=16----------Current ranking=1
8) Perfect Letum: (22 win-31 loss)----------Total point=4----------Current ranking=9

Conclusion:
Pros:
1) This system accurately indicate the strength of clan
2) It is far more fair than the previous system, with clans winning most, and losing least CWs throughout the season reach 1st place
3) Playing more CWs have a better chance to come higher place. It will thus stimulate CWs among clans.

Cons:
1) CP disparity is too large=Weaker clan has less chance to reach higher place.

----> So you must choose. Be fair to truly skilled clan or be fair to weaker clan?
( Desu's % count also have this problems)

Further suggestions:
On the grounds of not drastically change CW system, but providing a fair competing environment:
1) Cancel the idea of letting clan has100 CPs each game, while the majority have only 50.
100 is too much. How about 50-75?

2) Widen CW counted from 20-30/40/50

I like this one.. although 25 CWs should be a SET max.

With system like that I could make some alts, dummy clan and make 300 points in a day...

I agree that current system is wrong. High competence hinders clans in cw rankings and that is simply wrong.

Perhaps a good cw system would be simply competence gain in a season. System would just check competence of clan in the beginning of the season and at the end. Clan that gained most competence would be 1st... Every cw game would count and win against stronger (more competence) clan would be rewarded more. Intentionally loosing 20-30 matches in the beginning of the season would not work anymore. I see a problem with such system... Clans with very high competence would gain competence more slowly so perhaps some kind of combination of current competence and competence gain in a season would work better.

I support the new ranking system and the adjustment to have unlimited CWs counted. I don't think a limit is necessary do to the fact that under this system losses will hurt you. Also, even though potential for gains from playing CWs can be beneficial and lead to higher point values, this is a positive due to the fact that we should be rewarding more active clans.

I think we should have this system as a separate ranking system from cp (competence derived).

There would be two ranking tables, one that ranked by points, awarded as invisible suggested, and the other table to be the same as the current one.
The points table would display all cws, the cp table would display only the last 20 like it is now.
At the end of each season the top 3 in both tables would be given an award (the one based on cp could be relabeled "best gainers" or something).

This would offer a compromise between the old system and the new system, still showing which clans improve the most but simultaneously showing the best overall clans in an objective fashion.
What do you think?

How about if you just multiply the cp by the amount of points total and divide by the games that season?

You would still have to make it unlimited cws in order to prevent some coalitions (evoL) from losing games that don't count so that their cp skyrocker when they win

Kirjoittanut Goblin, 05.05.2014 at 09:56

Con:
- this system would be accurate if every clan has the same amount of CW's against all other clans (league system)
- league system would be impossible to set up for it to really work

This is not league system. It has unlimited CWs counted. Therefore you need to keep playing to surpass your enemy, while losing too much, with each loss resulting a reduction of 2 points, will lower your points

Being a top clan should in include 2 things

1) Winning
2) Activity

Therefore I much prefer 3 points awarded for winning and 1 point awarded for losing. This way even losing gives you points and clans aren't afraid to CW. I think this is a better system. The idea is that you are rewarded for just playing a CW and given extra rewards for winning a CW

Kirjoittanut Acquiesce, 05.05.2014 at 14:11

Being a top clan should in include 2 things

1) Winning
2) Activity

Therefore I much prefer 3 points awarded for winning and 1 point awarded for losing. This way even losing gives you points and clans aren't afraid to CW. I think this is a better system. The idea is that you are rewarded for just playing a CW and given extra rewards for winning a CW

agree without even reading it

Hurts new clan. Because of more game. the older clan would have more cp point because of lots of win game + win game give> lose game, cp given or subtracted.

Kirjoittanut Htin, 05.05.2014 at 15:01

Hurts new clan. Because of more game. the older clan would have more cp point because of lots of win game + win game give> lose game, cp given or subtracted.

Which is perfectly fine as long as everyone goes back to 0 at the end of the season

The more I look at this idea, along with the suggestions of the other users, the more I like it. I think I will definitely support this idea but with the inclusion that aqui made, 3points for win, 1 for a loss, that is a very strong idea. I would not suggest the abandonment of competence altogether but would suggest that it remain separate. The new "colaition points" achieved in the season could determine the winner, while the old competence calculations remain as they always have showing the clans with high competence etc. Clan competence shows how the clans have performed basically since their creation hence I think it should be preserved while "colaition points" can be reset every season and be used only for calculation of season winners.

The reason I would support this idea is it is very simple; should be easy enough to implement.

Kirjoittanut Acquiesce, 05.05.2014 at 20:44

Kirjoittanut Htin, 05.05.2014 at 15:01

Hurts new clan. Because of more game. the older clan would have more cp point because of lots of win game + win game give> lose game, cp given or subtracted.

Which is perfectly fine as long as everyone goes back to 0 at the end of the season

OK

Kirjoittanut Acquiesce, 05.05.2014 at 14:11

Being a top clan should in include 2 things

1) Winning
2) Activity

Therefore I much prefer 3 points awarded for winning and 1 point awarded for losing. This way even losing gives you points and clans aren't afraid to CW. I think this is a better system. The idea is that you are rewarded for just playing a CW and given extra rewards for winning a CW

Umm I don't agree. Even though I don't like reduction of points for losing. 1 point just for playing means Clans who have played the most wins. Imagine Mk playing 50 cw winning 40 losing 10. So it is 130 points. Again imagine Evol playing 150 wining 10 losing 140 having 170 total points. Is it fair for Evol to win even though Mk won 4 times more having played one third the games. You have to keep the balance somewhere and discourage farming as much as possible.

Kirjoittanut minusSeven, 06.05.2014 at 11:04

Kirjoittanut Acquiesce, 05.05.2014 at 14:11

Being a top clan should in include 2 things

1) Winning
2) Activity

Therefore I much prefer 3 points awarded for winning and 1 point awarded for losing. This way even losing gives you points and clans aren't afraid to CW. I think this is a better system. The idea is that you are rewarded for just playing a CW and given extra rewards for winning a CW

Umm I don't agree. Even though I don't like reduction of points for losing. 1 point just for playing means Clans who have played the most wins. Imagine Mk playing 50 cw winning 40 losing 10. So it is 130 points. Again imagine Evol playing 150 wining 10 losing 140 having 170 total points. Is it fair for Evol to win even though Mk won 4 times more having played one third the games. You have to keep the balance somewhere and discourage farming as much as possible.

I agree with you. The idea of reducing points for losing is to strike a delicate balance between activity and strength.

Kirjoittanut Dragon, 06.05.2014 at 11:17

Kirjoittanut minusSeven, 06.05.2014 at 11:04

Kirjoittanut Acquiesce, 05.05.2014 at 14:11

Being a top clan should in include 2 things

1) Winning
2) Activity

Therefore I much prefer 3 points awarded for winning and 1 point awarded for losing. This way even losing gives you points and clans aren't afraid to CW. I think this is a better system. The idea is that you are rewarded for just playing a CW and given extra rewards for winning a CW

Umm I don't agree. Even though I don't like reduction of points for losing. 1 point just for playing means Clans who have played the most wins. Imagine Mk playing 50 cw winning 40 losing 10. So it is 130 points. Again imagine Evol playing 150 wining 10 losing 140 having 170 total points. Is it fair for Evol to win even though Mk won 4 times more having played one third the games. You have to keep the balance somewhere and discourage farming as much as possible.

I agree with you. The idea of reducing points for losing is to strike a delicate balance between activity and strength.

Get what you guys are saying, that is why in last comment I suggested 0 points for loss or -1. 0 Seems very fair ! Apparently my comment was in the other thread:)

Support. I agree with the suggestion, nothing more to add.

Kirjoittanut Acquiesce, 05.05.2014 at 14:11

Being a top clan should in include 2 things

1) Winning
2) Activity

Therefore I much prefer 3 points awarded for winning and 1 point awarded for losing. This way even losing gives you points and clans aren't afraid to CW. I think this is a better system. The idea is that you are rewarded for just playing a CW and given extra rewards for winning a CW

This is basically saying a clan can cw everyone 100x times and get 1st if they lose every game bc they play the most that isnt fair at all. The winners should be the top not the clans who play the most and lose every game.

As a temporary solution for the time being, which would be easy for the admins to implement without taking too much time from html5, simply reduce coalition points gained per win to 50 regardless of comp. and increase counted cw limit to 30.

although as a future solution, invisibles system sounds perfect. support.

A well organized league is the best solution,other than that their will always be threads like this no matter how many times the CW system is changed.

The community is willing to help admins change the current system. They just need to listen to the threads like these, all good valid ideas.